Sadun Kal appeals to Crowe to engage properly with his critics, and gets told to bugger off


On 1 December 2009 Sadun Kal wrote Crowe:

I still look at all that stuff and I think that trying to ignore it will result in long-lasting damages to RA. If the president of RA values the contributions (past+potential future) of people like Anthony Brink and the members of the Perth Group to the cause, then I guess we can safely conclude that it really needs his attention.

To be specific, what needs attention is not whether or not Brink thinks Crowe is an extremely stupid person, in my opinion, but why Brink feels the need to make statements of that kind. It could be argued that he's just a mad man, but then why wasn't he so mad a year ago?

I certainly wouldn't call David Crowe stupid, but I think I did observe a certain inability/unwillingness on Crowe's side to objectively discuss the relevant, important issues. Whatever the exact reasons for the lack may be I believe that this has resulted in Brink not even bothering to truly communicate with Crowe any longer, thinking that Crowe will always try to evade the issues he cares about. As a result of that frustration he doesn't hesitate to use offensive adjectives for what he possibly considers an objective description of David Crowe.

The obvious solution to this on Crowe's side would be for Crowe to forget about everything that limits his sincerity and show some genuine interest in Anthony Brink's perspective, and talk about it all openly, honestly, handle it without bias and without coming up with weak excuses to defend "his side". I doubt that Crowe can suddenly change his stance, and I think it would take some effort to convince Brink that he did it even if he could really do it, but I suspect that Crowe et al. will continue to be attacked from within until they can achieve that.

What Brink can do is perhaps to be more open-minded about what Crowe can achieve, and stop making it harder for Crowe to open up through his constant attacking. Brink may say that he has already tried that, but even so trying that again, maybe more carefully and persistently this time, can bring better results.

I'm also fairly skeptical though, because I don't know the exact reasons behind Crowe's defensive, closed stance. I have a few guesses but ultimately I don't know. I think it precedes the hostility he was exposed to. Is the obstacle something that he can overcome on his own? I don't know that either. But until I see some evidence for his sincerity in these matters, a willingness to discuss, clarify and make some progress in terms of increasing the overall understanding of differing perspectives within the dissident community, I'm afraid we will continue to suffer from long-lasting damages. I'd at least hope that he can be clear about his limitations under current circumstances, whatever they are.

All in all, if both sides decide to show some true good will, simultaneously and persistently, then I think there can be a proper resolution. Otherwise I'm confident that this will go on in an unpleasant manner... especially when considering that pretty much everyone prefers to look away from this conflict and remain silent instead of striving for a solution...

Before I finish let me ask:

- Could Anthony Brink consider giving David Crowe another chance(s) and agree to communicate with him as another caring, thinking human being, or is he irreversibly attached to his current subjective judgment?

- Could David Crowe sincerely try to be much more willing to discuss all the issues surround this conflict openly, honestly and objectively, or does he think that he's already doing all that as well as humanly possible?





Every email like this convinces me more that you are an agent provocateur. And I'm not going to bite.


David Crowe




What does it mean "to bite" in this context? What are you saying that you won't do?

All I suggested to you was more honesty, sincerity, openness, objectivity, a willingness to discuss etc.

Pretty nice for an agent provocateur, no? I wish all humans could "bite" things like these.

But anyway, you "biting" alone wouldn't be enough. Anthony Brink isn't willing to bite either apparently.

Do as you wish. But at least try to be aware of the consequences of such non-biting.

And note that the only difference between my suggestion and yours* was that it wasn't only about what Brink could do; it also included a few things about what you could do better, which seems to have horrified you. I think your reaction to my email was pretty strange. Maybe you can go into a little bit more detail and tell exactly what you found so insincere about what I said..?


*: "...Actually talking to me, let alone talking to me as another caring, thinking, human being, with a lot in common does not appear to have crossed his mind for a long time.
Continuing to hoe the row of hatred can reap only bitter fruit, I'm afraid..."



Crowe didn't reply.